Is it really worth For Sharon

Canada Immigration Forum (discussion group)


 
       
Subject: Is it really worth For Sharon
  Sharon, I don´t understand if I´m outside of Canada why can´t I comment on Canadian job market. I´m also a Canadian citizen, fully aware of the country and have the full right to warn people about the bleak job market. I at least have the right to share my experience. Any positive experience is also welcome and I wouldn´t say anybody "Stop making positive remarks". This days, if somebody has internet access, he/she can study a lot from anywhere in the country, and I´m just in the US with lots of ties in Canada. I don´t say anything unless somebody wants any suggestions, and I can´t simply lie.

Canada has record lowest unepmloyment, true. That really doesn´t make a whole lot of sense for the professionals. Canada is traditionally a service oriented country, not high tech countries like USA that can always offer jobs. In fact, by theory, unemployment rates of the 2 countries are very close. BUT, in reality, for the professionals, Canada is just a graveyard. That is not any area specific (like only Doctors or Engineers), it is absolute true for any proffession. Even the local university degree holders have to struggle a battle to just get a job. If you are interested, then I could post you several Canadian publications about the brain drainage from Canada and you would be glad to know that after 1995, this number is increasing dramatically. Reports clearly show, higher the education level, more likely for him/her to leave Canada. I personally know at least 20-25 Masters degree holders of U of T (myself and all of my immigrants friend), Ryerson,and Windsor who left Canada for the US. Not that they were driven by money, they simply didn´t find any job there, in their own country. What else can be more devastating than that?

Why do the highly educated top professionals have to leave such "Land of Oppurtunity"? This is not any white/black issue, this is a sad untold fact. Immigrants have to switch professions, nice idea. What´s the demanding profession? Alberta is not anything elastic.

I don´t say anything out of air. I can post Stat Canada reports about the immigrants success rate. Morever, just recalling the ON immigration minister´s own word aired in the W-5 TV program about professional immigration, " This is nothing but inviting someone in your home and then ask him to wash your dish". I hope that explains everything for those who are confused. To you, may be he also doesn´t know the bright prospect of Canada and must be stopped like me. Minister or so What!

[18-10-2006,01:06]
[**.154.164.106]
Shah
(in reply to: Is it really worth For Sharon)
I already agreed that Canada has problems with foreign credentials. Any employer will tell you that not every university degree makes you job ready!

I have no problem with your opinion or your comments until you start talking in absolutes. At that point you lose all credibility as far as I am concerned.

[18-10-2006,01:34]
[***.121.220.199]
Sharon
(in reply to: Is it really worth For Sharon)
I always agree that foreign credentials should not be readily recognized. Tha´s not only for Canada, even in super hot US market, nobody should hope to have a job directly with foreign credential. That was not my issue. This has long been in use to simplify the job problem in Canada. As I mentioned before, I could show you statistics of how many thousands of Canadian educated profesionals have to good bye Canada every year for ever. There must be very good reasons for them to do that being a proud citizen of UN #1 country.

Specifically show me what is "absolute". I am afraid that you also would say ON Immigration minister lost his credibility by making his public statement.

[18-10-2006,10:09]
[***.254.208.242]
Shah
(in reply to: Is it really worth For Sharon)
my first question is how does stats can account for those new immigrants that land and turn around to go back to the US or some other place within weeks of landing. How does CIC account for those who have no intention of settling in Canada and they pay the 730 day game. Are they part of the unhappy unemployable?

given that Canada has a shrinking birth rate, and our population is increasing - I guess it is safe to say that at least a few are staying. CIC would be quite happy if 50% of all applicants withdrew from the immigration process. 5-6 year wait is too much for anyone and the shorter line of more appropriate candidates would be much appreciates on all sides.

If you find a brick layer, or a carpenter, or machinist out there... can you send them our way!

[18-10-2006,14:42]
[***.121.220.199]
Sharon
(in reply to: Is it really worth For Sharon)
Sharon, brain drainage data (Stat canada) shows average migration (permanent) rate to US per year (1990-96) is 21700 per year, and equal no. leaving for elsewhere in the world. Stat Canada preapared this data based on just Tax information which many agencies highly discredited. Also remember, this data doesn´t show the no. of the migrants going on Temporary work permit (like me). So the actual no. is much higher even in white eyes. A quote,
"1996 INS estimate, there are 120,000 Canadians (Canadian born and immigrant Canadians) living in the United States
illegally, or as "undocumented immigrant population." About half of them "entered legally on temporary basis and failed to depart.? All published studies have failed to recognize their existence. These individuals are supposedly young, energetic hardworking Canadians who are contributing to the US economy.". Means, these hard working productive Canadians prefered to stay USA illegally being a proud Canadian citizen. I feel ashamed of being a Canadian. The graph clearly shows that after 95, the rate is increasing in a curvelinear fashion (earlier it was straight linear).
Read http://www.ccis-ucsd.org/PUBLICATIONS/wrkg20.PDF. Even Stat Canada reported that, they guys leave for US are among the top rankings in the class.
Many countries in the world have lower population increase and even lower unemployment rate. But they don´t accept the frenzy Canadian way of immigration. I also read the report of the Canadian Economic Council on immigration where they clearly stated that there is no evidence of economic achievements and population increase.
Canadians never want to discuss about this and not worried at all as Canada doesn´t need the educated people. But personally I feel really ashamed when I have to face the US officers to renew my work permit being a proud citizen Un #1 country.

So, you are also not looking for the Doctors, Engineers, or Accountants, rather looking for the Carpenters, painters, or machinists. Honest acknowledgement. I simply don´t understand why CIC doesn´t advertise in this honest way. No point of inviting an Engineer and then ask him to paint a house.

My opinion is the entire immigration process is designed in evil intension. Just to run the Canadian economy and pay the free medicare, old age, social security. At the same time, providing the business owners a Roman Emperpor ensuring cheap labors.

[18-10-2006,15:47]
[***.254.208.242]
Shah
(in reply to: Is it really worth For Sharon)
I would not say it is full of evil intentions... I would say it this way - the laws forbid the CIC criteria to be changed for anyone already in the system (AOR). The goverment is historically slow in responding to the needs of business. Business (read Canada) has been screaming for years about its skill needs and the law prevents the right people from being provided. The biggest screamers are those currently waiting for their PR - they don´t want the rules changed - they want their PR - job or not! Rules were changed in 2003 and all hell broke loose.

In the time I have spent on this forum, there is a large group of CIC applicants that see Canada as their back door entrance into the US. Canada has never been their true objective. Nobody ever follows those applicants to compare their success to what it might have been in Canada.

as for your opinion about Roman Emperors and cheap labour... last time I checked a carpenter was earning more than a IT worker.

The minute you start framing this discussion in terms of white and cheap labour... you tell me that this conversation is a waste of time. Hope the US works well for you.

My pet peeve is university students (immigrant or otherwise) who do not do their job market research in advance of choosing their course of studies and then cry the blues upon graduation because there are not jobs in their field of study. An education is an education. Job preparation should be based on interest, aptituted, and opportunity. No point in training to be a blacksmith if we don´t use horses for transportation any more.

You have been able to work in the US. Are you on a permit? How long is that permit good for? What happens when you get laid off - do you go home? do you become illegal? I don´t consider that a nice way to have to live in the supposed best country on earth!

[18-10-2006,16:21]
[***.121.220.199]
Sharon
(in reply to: Is it really worth For Sharon)
Hi Shah,
I had a similar discussion a few months back with someone in this forum. Its good that you have made the points (again !!) that are necessary for the future immigrant professionals to judge the market and reality, but believe me once you are past that point, don´t bother about continuing it further, sometimes people just don´t get it !

[18-10-2006,16:29]
[***.242.242.2]
Raj
(in reply to: Is it really worth For Sharon)
Shah, Raj... this forum is about Canadian immigration. People come here with their minds already made up for the most part about what they intend to do.

Why are you here? Shah - you have moved on to better opportunities. You are as bad as a divorced man who continues to talk about his ex wife! Are you suggesting that Canada is hopeless for everyone??? Raj... was is your purpose here? to tell everyone how you failed to do your homework or were too stubborn to adapt to realities?

Canadian born citizens who find themselves in similar situations are either pitied for being stuck in the past or ignored because they were too stupid to think for themselves.

Every CIC applicant has a personal obligation to do their own research, know their limits, know the need for their skill set, determine where their skills might be valued (there is life beyond Toronto). It is not CIC´s job to have a therapy session with each applicant.


[18-10-2006,16:48]
[***.121.220.199]
Sharon
(in reply to: Is it really worth For Sharon)
Shah - why did you leave your country in the first place? no work after you got your education? did not like the lifestyle? Raj - same question to you! what made you think if you were not successful at home that you would be successful somewhere else?

if you were doing well at home... why on earth would you want to leave? did you think you could pick money off a tree in some Canadian back yard so you could go home and be a rich big shot?

that is not real life in Canada or anywhere else.


[18-10-2006,16:54]
[***.121.220.199]
Sharon
(in reply to: Is it really worth For Sharon)
Sharon for all the bs you keep on here, and for playing those arab schlongs, you need to go to whupping post one of these days,
[18-10-2006,17:06]
[***.202.54.107]
right man
(in reply to: Is it really worth For Sharon)
I should be whipped for having an opinion? How civilized of you!
[18-10-2006,17:15]
[***.121.220.199]
Sharon
(in reply to: Is it really worth For Sharon)
Sharon, there seems to be a confusion because of my word (white Eye I guessed). I didn´t mean it as racial white/black terms. I just meant to say something like easily understandable or clear. My apology for that. I never ever claimed that job difficulty is because of racism. It is just lack of jobs.

Yes, like me, many immigrants are using Canada as the launching pad to the USA. But, please read the articles I sent you, not only the immigrants, many many born citizens also do that. Need to seriously think what forces these guys to move out their country or immigrate twice.

A carpenter may earn more than a IT people. True. But not the usual case. I know some plumbers or welders earn more than 100K. That doesn´t mean that a University IT grad would prefer to go for Carpentery or plumbing job. Roman Emperor? They have abundant supply of labor around. Employees have minimum benefits in Canada. Why? because of that. If I say somebody in US that you would need to face 3 interview for a min´m wage Walmart help associate job he wouldn´t believe me. Based on mt work experience in Canada ( not in straight way as usual, got a Technician job through a friend which are supposed to be for the high school grads), I can say for sure that If I´m even offered a better higher job in Canada, I wouldn´t return.

The usual slow process you told is another point of mine for what I wouldn´t prefer Canada. Not only Govt., the entire country is lathergic and customer service is unthinkably poor.

I´m on Temporary work permit in US. Have to wait for some years to get the GC there. What´s the problem? I just can´t vote there (matter to me?). Eventually I would get it. I would wait rather 10 years to have itwhile continuing a respectable proffesional life rather than the life of a proud citizen of Canada with best school Masters degree and doing a menial job. Lay off??? Nobody can deny that possibility. However, here the case is just the opposite. Every month I got 2/3 offers from other companies (don´t even know where do they get my contact). Our company even pays bonus for referal. If for any reason I got laid off, then within 3 days I would be able to manage at least 5 jobs. So which life sounds better upto you.

Americans never ever claimed there country as the best place on the earth. They are not that kind a cloun. You may not consider US as the option, that´s fine. Should preach your theory to the many thousands every year who head for the US and listen what they say. America may not be the best place, but at least ensures that the University Graduates of the country don´t have to seek job elsewhere.

[18-10-2006,17:21]
[***.254.208.242]
Shah