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| Subject: Stay with the subject |
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To Almost Perfect!!, sorry to disappoint but I can´t melt away yet because I like to debate with you further. The issue originally raised by KK was whether Canada would remain attractive for immigrants given the rise of China & India as economic powers. I don´t see why you have to bring in the UK & US in your arguments. We should stay with the subject, which involves Canada, China & India only.
I acknowledge China & India are economic giants because of huge population sizes but just can´t agree they can be called economic superpowers now and in the near future. China & India are currently doing well because they have a vast pool of cheap labor. China is mainly an assembler of products for American, Japanese, EU & Taiwanese Companies. Indians contribute mainly in the IT services sector. Doing cheap labor work for others is not something to be proud of. The truth about these two countries is they are saddled with problems of overpopulation and inadequate job openings. Hundreds of millions of their citizens are still living in poverty. When these millions become middle-class, then may be China & India are entitled to be called superpowers. Canada, on the other hand, does not have such problems and should be attractive for immigrants.
[06-05-2007,08:11]
[**.52.95.83]
snow25 |
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(in reply to: Stay with the subject)
OK! Let?s stay on the subject. First of all you can not compare India or China with Canada. Just look at their histories. India is as old as the earth itself and so is China. People have been living in these countries for millions of years. These countries were at one time the greatest civilizations on the planet and hence, the first of all immigration happened here. People from all over the known world at that time ? Middle East, Africa, and the Far East etc. immigrated to India because there were more opportunities for trade and economic development. Then the Brits came and looted the country in the more recent centuries.
Some of the world?s first Universities and educational institutions were opened in India and China.
Now think about the history of Canada. There is mention of indigenous peoples in history but may be limited to a page or a little more. There is no history of Canada before the mid seventeenth century. That means this country is an infant when compared to India or China ? People only started living here recently and in a few decades (If not a few millennia like in India and China), the population will increase! Hence the difference is population is explained.
If you go back to the original page of this topic, you will notice that I stuck to the topic until Tom involved US and its economy. Then I had to involve that country. For me, the US is as good as non-existent because I do not consider that human beings are living there anymore. I am saying this by not just ?visiting? the country but after living there for more than five full years and choosing to leave out of choice. My comments might hurt some but I have to be fair like the others here.
I have to bring UK into the topic because this country played a vital role in holding India back from developing sooner than now. Some may argue, the Brits brought English language to India. I would like to disclose the fact that Indians were not allowed to study English in India until Independence. Only a handful could go to Europe to study English. Moreover, the Brits were no different from the Apartheid rulers of South Africa; there were areas/ places in India which were marked ?Dogs and Indians not allowed?. This shows you how civilized is the civilized world. (This topic requires at least a year?s discussion for many to understand)
You must also note that Canada?s population is only concentrated in certain areas and not through out. A large part of the country is unfit for inhabitation as it is filled with mountains of ice. This will further limit its development. Look at Toronto- It is soon getting over crowded. This is also an example why population in India/ China is huge. These countries attracted immigrants with opportunities when there was nothing in the rest of the world. This can be said of Canada today- totally in agreement with this one!
Tar Sands is like a drop of oil in a bag of Sand. So, it will be too expensive to extract. It does not even flow like oil. There is some which can be extracted at a heavy price but even that is much less than the oil in Saudi alone, leave the whole Middle East.
You asked what have India and China got? Well if you shut your TV off and put aside your news papers, and ?live? in these countries, you will know what they?ve got. I?ve had the worst customer service in a developed country (I am not naming it since you didn?t like it last time) not only at malls but at Air ports, Banks, Hospitals, everywhere. And I am not an exception.
For some people, it is hard to believe that those who immigrate are loyal to their countries. Well, no matter how selfish you are, or how far you go; you should always remember where you came from. There is nothing wrong in immigrating and if a man is loyal to his own country, he will be loyal to his new country. To talk about loyalty to one?s country is a big thing and a serious allegation. Example: If you go to California from New York because you have better opportunities there, you are not disloyal to N.Y. You are still a Yankee!!
Humans are selfish but not everyone leaves a place for money. If that is true, the many hundreds of thousands of Indians leaving the US and going back every year should never leave as there is presumably more money in the US.
Comparing India to Japan and other countries doesn?t make sense as according to some sources, Japan has been independent since 660B.C. It lost wars but it was never ruled by foreigners who normally suck off the wealth of an entire nation. Germany became independent in 1871 and India became independent in 1947. Losing wars doesn?t stop a country from developing nor take away previous developments. Being occupied by other country will hinder a country?s development because the occupiers suck off the developments and siphon them to their country. To appreciate a country?s development, one should be open to know things about it than just prejudge.
Your posts seem racist, prejudiced & show disrespect to other countries as you completely and bluntly disregard other countries? goods and achievements. You only see the bad in other countries & the following posts tell what you know about them:
1. ?What have China & India got? Their factories depend on massive importation of raw materials. Canada will lose some low-end manufacturing jobs but overall, its prospects for young people seeking a higher quality of life free from pollution are much, much better than over-crowded China & India.?
2. ?had visited China & India not too long ago and I didn?t like what I saw there - the pollution, the disrespect for human dignity, corruption etc. These two countries will never be "super powers.?
This is only the tip of the iceberg. If you really want to discuss and gain knowledge about other foreign countries let me know.
[06-05-2007,11:20]
[***.187.168.3]
Almost Perfect!! |
(in reply to: Stay with the subject)
Looks like snow25 does not know reality and not willing to accept it. I doubt if he has heard word GDP, go figure snow25, you will know why China and India are predicted to be economic superpowers in next 20 years.
[06-05-2007,16:37]
[**.186.3.211]
reality |
(in reply to: Stay with the subject)
almost perfect, Nice shot !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
[07-05-2007,06:14]
[***.130.100.180]
REVANTH |
(in reply to: Stay with the subject)
To Almost Perfect!!, Thanks for your long arguments. I´m sorry to inject a few controversial remarks. They were necessary to stir debate. I´m not a racist or like to look down on certain countries. Just want to get at the truth.
[07-05-2007,22:08]
[**.52.42.217]
snow25 |
(in reply to: Stay with the subject)
People haven´t been living in India or china for million of years....Homo Sapien, as a species, is a couple of million years ago...and the migration from their African origin to the rest of the world itself took a long time.
You can say that Indian civilisation is old...Harappan is said to be about 4 to 5000 years ago..roughly contemporary with Egyptian.
To judge a countries future economic power based on history is not realistic. Infact, almost all countries with old histories are now second rate powers. Call it overpopulation, call it depletion of resources or whatever, it seems to be the general rule. The only exception is Europe, which itself has a very old history and some parts of it are still advanced.
Canadian and American history is basically an extension of European (anglo-saxon) history.
The main criteria of being a economic superpower is how much you can export. Countries like Canada or USA have immense natural resources...far more than their meagre populations need. A lot of Canada might be mountain and ICE but it has immensely fertile land in Alberta/Sakatechwan/Manitoba and other than that, it has many other resources, like lumber, water, Iron, Uranium, Copper etc.
The problem with India is that no matter how much it advances economically, its population is beyond redemption. The wealth can never be enough to raise standard of so many millions of people. A large part will continue to live in poverty and hence, social unrest will continue to be a problem. Some resources in India are on the verge of depletion. Consider water. No matter how advanced your technology be, you can´t create water. Some gulf countries can distill sea water but thats because they have unlimited energy resources.
But to people who say that countries like India contribute to pollution etc., I say CRAP.
It a well known statistical fact that less than 20% of population that belongs to the ´rich´ part of the world contributes to more than 70% of world pollution and resource depletion. A child born in a ´developed´ countries uses resources equal to 12 children born in ´developing´ or ´underdeveloped´ countries. Thats called ´overconsumption´ and is much more of a problem than overpopulation.
And to answer the final question about migrating to Canada from India: I choose Canada anyday. I don´t want to pay bribes for every little thing. I don´t want to feel like an individual in a beehive (the feeling one gets in Indian cities). I want to be able to enjoy nature: forests, bogs, marshes, wilderness etc. Those things have allmost disappeared in india.I don´t want to be surrounded by the almost unbearable stupidity of bollywood all the time. I don´t want to live in a society that is either totally concentrated on generating career-professionals in computers, medicine or engineering or totally apathatic to all life. i want to live where arts are still enjoyed, literature is important, history is realistically studied.
[08-05-2007,13:35]
[**.122.3.240]
Memyself |
(in reply to: Stay with the subject)
To Memyself, I tend to share similar views like yours. On pollution, I agree China & India are not the main contributors to the world´s level. However, internally as in some industrialized cities of China, pollution is very bad. I´m aware the Chinese govt is implementing measures to curb this pollution and I wish them well.
[08-05-2007,22:46]
[***.187.42.251]
snow25 |
(in reply to: Stay with the subject)
To Cut long story short, Columbus discovered USA by fluke, he was actually on a voyage to find passage to india, so basically if it wasn´t for India USA would have never been discovered lol ..........
[10-05-2007,17:17]
[***.106.6.3]
Anonymous |
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