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| Subject: the value of CSIC |
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while there is some debate about fees and professional development training and ghost consultants, I think it is fair to suggest that having CSIC around is better than not having them at all.
If a prospective immigrant chooses to have Uncle Harry represent him... that is his choice and he takes his chances. Uncle Harry may or may not know the latest rules etc. If Uncle Harry makes a big mistake there is nobody to complain to except Antie Harriette. If Uncle Harry steels your money - oh well!
If a prospective immigrant wants to make the best effort to avoid being sold false information and promises, he would be best served by someone that is accountable and insured.
You can´t complain about Uncle Harry and you can´t ask for a settlement from an unregistered consultant. You CAN complain about a CSIC consultant and he or she will be judged by his or her peers. If that consultant messes up in a serious way, they lose that affilation of membership that likely provides them significant credibility.
While this is not perfect, this system is light years ahead of what was happening a few years back.
It is up to the prospective applicant to make some decisions - 1) fill the forms out themselves, 2) pay for advice and assistance that has no standards applied to it 3) get someone to help them for free - in which case you often get what you pay for or 4) pay someone that is willing to subject themselves to the rules of the industry and the scrutiny of his peers.
Even within #4, there are good and bad consultants. That is what references are for and the term ´buyer beware´. Having a consultant be a member of CSIC may not solve 100% of the problems but it is a step in the right direction in terms of credibility.
[07-11-2007,00:42]
[***.121.220.199]
Sharon |
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(in reply to: the value of CSIC)
That makes full sense. That´s why most of the professionals have to be licensed to practice individually.
However, I didn´t know that in immigration it is possible without any license or professional membership.
[07-11-2007,00:52]
[**.157.15.165]
Departed_Canadian |
(in reply to: the value of CSIC)
I could pass myself off as an immigration consultant. I know my way around the forms, I know most answers to basic questions and if I don´t - how would you know if I am wrong. You already gave me your money and I have promised that I can find you a job in Canada.
[07-11-2007,00:59]
[***.121.220.199]
Sharon |
(in reply to: the value of CSIC)
I just read my first post. I should really learn how to spell. My apologies.
[07-11-2007,02:40]
[***.121.220.199]
Sharon |
(in reply to: the value of CSIC)
I am not allowed to say CSIC is a mega failure! I am not allowed to say it is anything negative because I will be disciplined. BUT.......
What laws politicians create when they turn their obligation over to others sometimes explode.
On this forum many times I have said Lawyers are not educated in Immigration Law and learn by maki9ng mistakes like all of us. The following is a letter from the Law Society of upper Canada when I asked questions of the LSUC. I found a Lawyer had not filed an application for leave to appeal a negative IRB decision within the time frame and another Lawyer who had submitted a H&C application stating there was no Unusual or Undeserved Hardship I got the following response from the complaints department of the Law Society of Upper Canada (Ontario).
"The questions you ask appear to raise allegations of possible professional negligence rather than misconduct. Professional negligence is an error or omission on the part of a lawyer that causes a client harm or a loss. Whether or not negligence has occurred is a legal matter and is for the courts to determine rather than the Law Society. You may wish to consult with a lawyer with respect to your rights and remedies in this matter. If you decide to proceed to litigation and a presiding judge makes negative comments concerning the professional conduct of a lawyer, please forward a copy of the relevant transcript pages or the judge=s endorsement for our
review"
IN OTHER WORDS THEY DO NOTHING TO DISCIPLINE THEIR MEMBERS IN THIS TYPE OF SITUATION!!!
THEN WHO CAN REPRESENT A PERSON FOR A FEE IN AN IMMIGRATION MATTER???? yOU NEED TO READ THE LAST PARAGAPH OF INLAND PROCESSING MANUAL IP9 SECTION 2
"http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/resources/manuals/ip/ip09e.pdf
It is important to understand that CIC, the IRB and the CBSA are interpreting the Regulations to mean that R13.1(1) does not apply to any representations that are made to a client before an application is submitted to CIC. In other words, an applicant is obliged to disclose the name of their representative (authorized or unpaid) on the Use of a Representative (IMM 5476) form only if the individual will represent them once the application is submitted to CIC (i.e., either at the time of submission or postsubmission)."
THAT MEANS ANYONE CAN CHARGE ANYONE FOR ANY APPLICATION AS LONG AS THEY DO NOT INTEND TO REPRESENT THEM AFTER THE APPLICANT SUBMITS THEIR APPLICATION. THE ONLY THINGS SOMEONE CAN NOT DO IS APPEAR BEFORE A MEMBER OF THE IRB FOR A REFUGEE HEARING, APPEAR BEFORE A MEMBER OF THE APPEAL DIVISION REPRESENTING THEIR CLIENT ON HIS/HER APPEAL, APPEAR BEFORE A MEMBER OF THE IMMIGRATION DIVISION FOR A DETENTION REVIEW OR HEARING OR TALK TO AN OFFICER OF CBSA OR CIC AFTER THE CLIENT SUBMITS AN APPLICATION.
I AGREE WITH SHARON (wow is she ever right something is better then nothing) WHEN YOUR STARVING SHARON ANY FOOD IS BETTER THEN NO FOOD BUT.....GIVING A STARVING PERSON ONE GRAPE WILL NOT MAKE A HUGE DIFFERENCE, WILL IT????
GOOGLE THE REGULATORY IMPACT ANALYSIS STATEMENT REGARDING REGULATING CONSULTANTS------
YOU WILL FIND THE FOLLOWING QUOTE Most representatives represent their clients Professionally ethically and effectively but there is those that people smuggle and create false documents. THAT IS WHY THEY REGULATED CONSULTANTS BECAUSE SOEM WHERE PEOPLE SMUGGGLING AND CREATING FALSE DOCUMENTS.
Roy
www.cvimmigration.com
[07-11-2007,09:17]
[**.52.217.38]
Roy |
(in reply to: the value of CSIC)
Here is why the Politicians regulated consultants in the first place. OTHERS WOULD LIKE EVERYONE TO BELIEVE SOMETHING ELSE
http://canadagazette.gc.ca/partII/2004/20040414-x/html/sor59-e.html
Most representatives conduct their work in an ethical, professional and effective manner. However, there are persistent and credible reports that some unscrupulous immigration consultants, both in Canada and abroad, facilitate people smuggling and fabricate documents permitting foreign nationals to enter this country illegally.
YOU GUYS GOT MY BLOOD BOILING FIRST THING IN THE MORNING!
IF YOUR REALLY BAD IN ANY BUSINESS YOU WILL NOT BE IN IT FOR VERY LONG UNLESS YOUR RIPPING OFF YOUR OWN ETHNIC GROUP. IF YOUR VERY GOOD AND CARE ABOUT YOUR CLIENTS YOU WILL BE IN FOR A LONG TIME. THE CREAM ALWAYS RISES TO THE TOP IN EVERYTHING.
Roy
www.cvimmigration.com
[07-11-2007,09:28]
[**.52.217.38]
Roy |
(in reply to: the value of CSIC)
Anyones upbringing normally makes them ethical! Parents and other adults around the child while they are growing up sets the examples of proper behaviour.
No organization no matter how well intentioned can change how one normally behaves in their daily activities. Most Lawyers and Consultants work in a vacuum so little information leaks out regarding their own ethical behavior.
Clients all want the rules bent in their favor and will throw thousands of dollars for anyone to assist them with beating the system. ALL REPRESENTATIVES HAVE TO BE CAREFUL OF ANY CLIENT WITH UNLIMITED POCKETS.
I had a potential client come into my office who had submitted a spousal sponsorship after getting a negative PRRA decision which said get on the plane on a certain date. She did not!!!
Then che paid an unauthorized representative to submit another application for which she never got a copy or knows what was submitted if anything.
Then her friend who won her case brought her to me and I told her she would have to withdraw the Inland sponsorship, go into GTEC and have her arrest warrant executed and go home. Submit a spousal sponsorship from outside of Canada and seek authorization to return because of a stupid ill thought out refugee claim from __________.
The next day she sent me an e-mail and stated that even though she thought I was a JERK she was going to retain me. That she even knew of another woman who I had sent home and brought back who was he next door neighbour back home. SHE DIDN´T RETAIN ME!
She then went and hired another authorized representative who told her to remain underground until they would look at her marriage application.
On THURSDAY CBSA came knocking on her door, arrested her, threw her into detention and her husband came and retained me to assist. We are now going to bring her back the right way.
CLIENTS ALWAYS WANT THEIR DREAMS TO COME TRUE AND THINK CERTAIN REPRESENTATIVES CAN CREATE MIRACLES. I TELL THOSE POTENTIAL CLIENTS TO GO AND BUY A LOTTERY TICKET BECUASE IT IS $35,000,000 THIS WEDNESDAY.
I´M GOING TO WIN THE LOTTERY----YEAH RIGHT BUT STILL DREAMING.
I TELL THEM IF I COULD PULL RABBITS OUT OF A HAT OR PICK WINNING LOTTERY NUMBERS IN ADVANCE I WOULD BE IN VEGAS.
Roy
www.cvimmigration.com
[07-11-2007,10:26]
[**.52.217.38]
Roy |
(in reply to: the value of CSIC)
This issue could be very serious.
I hear many times stories of consultants behaving inappropriately. Some take money from the clients and just disappear (specially if you aren´t in Canada), some don´t respond.....Even I heard allegation aganists some lawyers.
If someone wants to take the risk by chosing anyone, that is his call. But at least the practicing members of the professional soceities should act honestly & sincerely.
[07-11-2007,10:33]
[***.254.208.242]
Departed_Canadian |
(in reply to: the value of CSIC)
DC,
Most Immigration lawyers and Immigration Consultants (CSIC Members) are honest, but like in any organisation or even families, there is always a few rotten oranges that spoils the barrel.
www.canadaimmigrationbpa.com
[07-11-2007,12:08]
[**.158.155.109]
Balwant |
(in reply to: the value of CSIC)
Balwant,
I know that. Lile in all professions, some bad apples are here too.
But, problem is, if you can´t abide anybody within an acountable system then this bad apples will grow more & more.
[07-11-2007,12:26]
[***.254.208.242]
Departed_Canadian |
(in reply to: the value of CSIC)
as a naive immigration applicant, the small protection offered by CSIC is better than the horrible free for all out there. CSIC is not for Consultants - it is for consumers.
IF you can´t afford the fees but you are honest - good for you but as a prospective client, that is a big IF.
I, for one, support the existence of CSIC in all its imperfections and annoying regulations.
[07-11-2007,12:53]
[***.121.220.199]
Sharon |
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