For Richard-SW Applicants No.

Canada Immigration Forum (discussion group)


 
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Subject: For Richard-SW Applicants No.
  Richard,

Here is the source that you asked for:
http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/print/CTVNews/20051119/w5_broken_promises_051119/20051121/?hub=WFive&subhub=PrintStory

"In 2000, Canadian embassies and consulates abroad received more than 300,000 immigrant skilled worker visa applications. But in 2004 that number declined to only 177,000.

Even more dramatic is the fall in skilled worker applications from China (including Hong Kong), which dropped from 60,000 in 2000 to only 8,000 in 2004".

I can tell for sure this drop is mainly due to the widespread news about the true reality of Canada; poor job market regardless of Govt. propaganda. I feel really astonished when see some folks denying this totally and start debating childishly.

USA is not Canadian immigration major source; major sources are the under countries. Free quality healthcare is also very positive thing, but certainly they care more for the career. Few may still motivated by the healthcare but majority will consider more the job oppurtinites to decide. That´s why Free Healthcare can´t offset the immigration from Canada to USA. Your case is within the exceptions. Right ot wrong that´s not the matter, that is important to you, whatever you decide you´ll go for that.

Fazal,( If you read this thread)

Good work and go ahead. Try to make a more elaborate investigation on departing skilled professionals; the no. and why they leave. Also try to identify how many even with Candian degrees have to leave Canada for job searching.


[25-01-2008,14:44]
[***.254.208.246]
Departed_Canadian
(in reply to: For Richard-SW Applicants No.)
Thanks DC. Very interesting.
[25-01-2008,16:26]
[**.53.225.236]
Richard
(in reply to: For Richard-SW Applicants No.)
Richard,

Can´t refrian myself from sharing with you.

From Quebec many non-French speakers are running out. I knew that.

Though I earlier had a feeling that French speakers/settlers are doing well in Quebec. Looks like I was wrong.

This is from Toronto Star Today:

"French in Quebec heading home: ´We are strangers here, and yet we had been assured we would be warmly welcomed´"
Full Story:
http://www.thestar.com/News/article/295542

Looks like French settlers are also feeling the same way like us.

[25-01-2008,16:52]
[***.254.208.246]
Departed_Canadian
(in reply to: For Richard-SW Applicants No.)
Yes, thanks again DC, an interesting and revealing report. A few months ago there also was an article about immigrants from France who returned:

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB118680079272894989.html?mod=googlenews_wsj

Kashif in France posted it then, while also asking this forum whether it is worth to move to Quebec. At that time, I didn´t agree with the rationale of that Wall Street Journal article. This one seems more truthfully straightforward.

Based on recent articles and reports, it does seem like Francophones are having unexpected hard times in adapting to life in Quebec. I´d like to see larger statistics rather than a few anecdotes, though. But it is disturbing.

The recommendation in the article to overhaul Canadian immigration in favor of younger candidates is in my opinion overreactive and strange. I think it would create a frontier kind of policy where only the young, fit, naive, and unopinionated would be favored over experienced, professional, and more mature candidiates.

Anyway, good to share such info.

[25-01-2008,17:35]
[**.53.225.236]
Richard
(in reply to: For Richard-SW Applicants No.)
Richard,

I agree fully (like always) few individual segregated stories don´t tell anything solid. Till now I also have no idea regarding French exodus from Quebec. Looks like it is a newer point of interest and have to wait for sometimes to have something solid. The Wall Street journal report is a good one, though as usual the Govt. side (Canadian Consulate Official of Paris) denied the job problem. The same broken record, ..some professions may be regulated...need to be licensed...

I think the proposition for more younger candidate is based on one of the main reason for mass immigration (at least by Govt. & their biassed quarters); to counter the aging population. Younger candidate propositors argue that if you invites immigrants to counter aging population then what´s the point of bringing someone in their late 40´s? Say if an Indian apply from there today at 44, by the time he´ll get the immigration & land they are alsmost at their 50. So, I think they have strong point.

My opinion is to blend both younger & experienced. It is hard for someone at their his 40s (no matter how well experienced he is) to start over his career aganist someone at early 30s.

Though before going there; main question to face the rerality. Access whether really there is any demand for the new immigrants. If any, then identify the occupations and quantify the numbers.

A recent report shows that only 1/3rd of total international students in Canada would like to settle in Canada.

http://www.canada.com/globaltv/ontario/story.html?id=9d0f7fa3-cb0b-455c-9988-d23b8fcb45d0&k=45989

Once ranked as a top-five destination for international students, Canada has dropped to 14th place among the world´s richest nations, well behind Belgium and Spain. This study is also indi the harsh reality of job market. If Canada has really skill shortage then why not try to keep this international students who are well trained upto the Canadian standard? Why this guys have to look for jobs elsehwere? it is well known that students from Asian countries come to the western countries with a high hope of settling there upon finishing their studies.

All evidence indicates into one direction.

[25-01-2008,18:05]
[***.254.208.246]
Departed_Canadian
(in reply to: For Richard-SW Applicants No.)

Dear DC,
All evidence?

Com´ on man, grow up.

The problem that I always have with your statments are that you GENERALIZED everything.

You as an immigrant didn´t make it here, well I immigrated to this country and it worked out for me.

It is not childish to defend a personal point of view. It is easy to talk about stats, global media but the bottom line is you didn´t make it here. That is ok. Canada is not for everyone nor the US.


What do I know... I am just a Southern Country bompkin from Fort Lauderdale FL.

Cheers

Bill

[25-01-2008,18:17]
[***.34.111.122]
Bill
(in reply to: For Richard-SW Applicants No.)
Dear Bill,

So far I don´t understand your point of view. I would sincerely request you to be specific. Otherwise it turns into peronality clash.

Clearly tell where do you see problems in my statements, you are also generalizing everything. I strongly encourage you to come up with some good explanations about the immigrant poor performance in Canada. Rather than reciting the same old things like "have to work hard....learn english..."

I´m not saying such words are incorrect. Very curious
to know why such words can be applied more to Canadian immigrants rather than USA or Australian. USA/Australia don´t give jobs to unqualified ones or who don´t know English. If you miss that, in Canada Immigrant Unemployement rate is more than double the national average, in USA it is below the national, and in Australia it slightly over. What do you think?

When an adult does want to ignore real data and want to argue with "I know..I see..My Friend tells me" like logic then I must have to say that is childish.

I always respect others opinion. Ask Richard. He is also a born American and Canada lover like you. However, he doesn´t have the bad tendency of hiding the face under the sand. That´s why without any hesitation he always agrees with me over the poor job issue in Canada.

"It is easy to talk about stats, global media but the bottom line is you didn?t make it here."- I didn´t understand anything about it. Are you trying to say that we can´t have any idea by refering to Stats/reports..? If you think so, then Good Luck. Have a good day, I don´t want to procede anymore with you.

I´m not a bit interested in where did you born, in Flordia, Youkon or Vietnam. I would feel curious about your logic. Not a single time I try to make any point that Canada is a bad country, USA is a paradise. All I´m saying is Canada can´t afford to accept professsional immigrants as they portray. That´s it. It has nothing to do with in overall ranking of Canada. That should be left for personal choice.

[25-01-2008,18:36]
[***.254.208.246]
Departed_Canadian
(in reply to: For Richard-SW Applicants No.)
DC, look like you got Bill´s ire up.

He may have a point. Yesterday I was reading an article in Macleans magazine about how Canada is among the top in reputation for most people in the world. In a recent poll of Americans, 91% said they thought they would have a better life in Canada than the U.S. As Macleans put it, "this coming from poll respondents living in the richest country on the planet."

http://www.newswire.ca/en/releases/archive/November2006/09/c2439.html

Canada works well for some, and not so well for others. But as I´ve ben saying, this is true of any new country for immigrants.

By the way, I´ve always been interested in Bill´s story, a fellow yank. I can´t rememeber if he was willing to share his rationale for leaving the States altogether. I seem to remember it was due to a good job opportunity. But he can tell me if none of my business.



[25-01-2008,18:39]
[**.53.225.236]
Richard
(in reply to: For Richard-SW Applicants No.)
And meant to add we may not always agree here, but DC always has good statistics and background in what he says. Although stats can backup any argument, DC´s point of view is usually thoughtful and well worth reading. I´ve clashed a few times with his anti-Canada point of view.

I´m not sure he or anyone here needs any recomendation to grow up. We´re already there, but just have different opinions.

[25-01-2008,18:46]
[**.53.225.236]
Richard
(in reply to: For Richard-SW Applicants No.)
Richard,

When someone says I don´t agree with you then definitely deserve to know " where & why"? Just don´t agree with you doesn´t mean anything. I was born in "X", so can´t agree or making my point??? Sad. I can produce many Stats..reports..but didn´t get it. What does it mean? Then how can I make my point? By indicating my birth place? Is there any point to invoke personality clash?

Also, keep in mind, I never will try to overall comparision of USA and Canada. As I always say, decision is yours. for the same reason I even wouldn´t compare Idnia and USA. There are many many Indians who can immigrate into USA/Canada but they don´t. In their choice, India is better. So? What´s the best? Totally relative.


This original posting had nothing do with USA/Canada comparison. Unncessarily that is again raised here. I only give my crystal clear solid opinion about the job market. If can contradict me then most welome to discuss.

I don´t have any objectio in your survey. I believe that is possible. This is also one of my observation (as a non North American) about the difference of American/Canadian mindset. Americans always prasie Canada. I rarely heard any American criticizing the Candians. On the other hand..sorry to say Canadians in general rarely see anything positive in America. So, that survey is very much possible.

However, does the inter migration rate between USA/Canada reflect that survey? To disappoint you, that is totally reverse. Not mentioning the data here as it wasn´t the core part here.

[25-01-2008,19:06]
[***.254.208.246]
Departed_Canadian
(in reply to: For Richard-SW Applicants No.)

Dear DC,

"Have a good day, I don?t want to procede anymore with you".

Hey Peace out amigo!!!
I don´t want you to get upset with me.

I do care about stats however,

If I have to base my life on stats, I shouldn´t be driving a car or drinking beer...and for Goshsakes a spinach could kill me!!!!!

When my ancestors came to America, there was NOTHING but farms and dry land. Over the years things have changed.

I see Canada as a young country with lots of potential.

I truly respect your point of view but I can´t understand why would you bring the topic of Canada´s poor economy over and over and over again and who ever is not agree with you and defends his/her point is childish?

Being one of the richest nations in the world, with a very low crime rate and my personal experience is the opposite of what you think, what do you expect me to say?

You say that "Canada can´t afford professional as they portray"....

Ohhhhh sure the accreditation system here sucks I agree.

But this is not the only country in the world who does it though. I would love to see if I can practice engineering in Germany???? Australia??? or NZ????
Probably not.

So?? what is that telling you.

I didn´t mean to offend anyone when I said "Grow up" sorry about that.

Cheers

Bill

[25-01-2008,19:32]
[***.34.111.122]
Bill
(in reply to: For Richard-SW Applicants No.)
DC, completely agree that personality comments and clashes are out of order here. Seems to me Bill was just charged up about comments here in the discussion that he didn´t agree with, and expressed it in his direct way. He´s usually pretty calm and collected here.

Regarding the Macleans survey. Yes, Americans praise Canada more than Canadians praise America. And more Canadian move to U.S. than reverse. But remember who is the elephant and who is the mouse in this equation.

America often appears arrogant, ignorant, and self-righteous to the rest of the world. Can you blame Canadians (and other countries) for being cynical about the U.S.? Thus hesitation to make praise.

The large, affluent, and consumer society will always tempt and draw people. I would always expect immigration to flow to these countries first, despite lack of understanding that underlying social systems don´t exist.

[25-01-2008,19:34]
[**.53.225.236]
Richard