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| Subject: Canadian Rights? - 2 |
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Funny how people like jp are so submissively willing to accept any border behavior in the name of government power and control. And get upset over exact titles for border services/immigration officials to boot. Seems to me this person has lost all self-respect in worshiping authority at any cost. I wonder who wears the panties in that relationship in fear of authority? Takes stones to stand up for individual rights (that obviously some are missing).
Some may agree or disagree with the original poster of the thread, but nevertheless this should be a civil discussion without resorting to insult. People on the super-patriotic, flag-waving right tend to succumb to this kind of reaction.
Immigration services on either side does not have unlimited freedom to harass its own citizens or even visitors. If so felt, OP should have filed a complaint with the station chief, and would have every right to do so.
[21-09-2009,15:10]
[**.192.28.31]
Richard |
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(in reply to: Canadian Rights? - 2)
I seriously doubt he would be submissive if the same thing happen to him. He probably be spewing out his gripes all over the forum. I think citizens should not be asked this sort of question. It is ridiculous to ask a citizen for what reason he/she is entering his own country and where he is going. That just irrelevant period. Anyone who think otherwise is just being in defensive mode.
[21-09-2009,15:48]
[**.51.250.143]
Anonymous |
(in reply to: Canadian Rights? - 2)
I heard an interview with border security and they mentioned that the questions are far less important than the tone and consistency of the answers. If people did not misrepresent their intentions, none of this would be necessary.
I went to the US to have dinner with a friend. I got the 3rd degree. where does she live, why do they live there, what are you doing there, how long were you there - why only for a few hours... what do you do for a living. This was US border staff. They were waiting for me to mess up. Eventually they stop asking. We have no idea what sort of alerts had come through that day and we have no idea what sort of job action may have played into this either.
In a perfect world, we should be treated politely. I bet border staff would say the same.
[21-09-2009,16:08]
[***.5.54.139]
Sharon |
(in reply to: Canadian Rights? - 2)
I cannot see what Richard sees here.
"I wonder who wears the panties in that relationship in fear of authority? Takes stones to stand up for individual rights (that obviously some are missing). "
Sorry, but your individual rights stop where my rights begin.
What harassment?
An officer questioning a person that travels back and forth?
Does anyone have a problem with that? I mean, I am pretty sure that every single person from/to Canada to the US has very nobel and trustworthy intentions. Hmmmm maybe not, THAT´S WHY IT´S THEIR DUTY TO SECURE OUR BORDERS!
If an officer is abusing of his/her power, then take them to a court of law.....
If you have no grounds to do so, well.... that is the law of the land.
I don´t know her situation and/or what tone did the officer use.
My point is that there is no crime for an officer to question where a citizen has been and doing what.
How can that possibly violate the charter of rights and freedoms?
Cheers,
Bill
[21-09-2009,17:06]
[***.75.247.138]
Bill |
(in reply to: Canadian Rights? - 2)
Many, many years ago returning home from Canada to the US I was asked at the US border to show my drivers license (as was common). The border official asked me for my address, and the one I gave was different that the one stated on my license. I had moved around quite a bit in the couple of years since my license had been issued, had a different hair color, was still quite young and was very nervous at all the questioning. After several guesses as to the address on the license (my parents? my address at university?) and getting it wrong, I got pretty nervous. It hit me after I somehow managed to convince border control that I was, indeed, me, that I had been danger of not being allowed into my own country.
Was that agent out of line? No, of course not and I never felt that he was. It was my own naive--and very innocent--nervousness that had caused the suspicion. It has never once crossed my mind that a border agent shouldn´t ask any questions he or she feels necessary to ensure that a person, whether visitor or citizen, is eligible to enter the country. I don´t see why it should be any other way.
[21-09-2009,17:20]
[**.252.115.196]
wannabecanadian |
(in reply to: Canadian Rights? - 2)
According to Bill, "Does anyone have a problem with that? I mean, I am pretty sure that every single person from/to Canada to the US has very nobel and trustworthy intentions. Hmmmm maybe not, THATīS WHY ITīS THEIR DUTY TO SECURE OUR BORDERS!"
Secure the border from what? Those terrorist neighbors, the ______ (fill in Canadians or Americans, depending which way you´re crossing". What are we so afraid of with each other? How come the Europeans have stopped this nonsense long ago (and don´t tell me they´re somehow different).
The issue is why do we have to control each other like cold war neighbors, first off? And then when we do, sometimes with suspicion, rudeness, and harassment? I´m not saying it´s the norm, but I´ve experienced it myself.
If some pimply-faced 25 year-old disgruntled Canadian border guard´s got a bad home life along with a power fetish, and decides to take it out on a visitor, it´s ok in the name of "securing our borders"? And as a solution, either shut up or go to court? That´s amusing.
[21-09-2009,18:33]
[**.192.28.31]
Richard |
(in reply to: Canadian Rights? - 2)
I would like to know how long this "open borders" are going to last in Europe.
And they are open just between them (EU)by the way. A Russian citizen needs a visa to visit Poland, most citizens from African countries require a visa to visit Germany, so this open borders thing has to be taken with a grain of salt. It is not always nice and colorful.
What is the alternative? Open our borders? and keep our homeland security to a minimum?
Not a hope.
Suspicion, rudness and harassment is a human behivour it is not the norm and it doesn´t happen to everyone in every single port of entry.
Cheers,
Bill
[21-09-2009,19:36]
[***.75.247.138]
Bill |
(in reply to: Canadian Rights? - 2)
Actually I get the third degree every once in a while going both ways.
Does not bother me.
And Richard No, I would not be on here wasting a forum on whining if someone who was DOING THEIR JOB asked me too many questions.
Yes I do love my freedom from drugs/rapist/pedophiles/murderers coming over the border.
Someone pulled out the terrorism theme above, yet I doubt most americans and Canadians are terrorists.
The Border Services Officers are there to question you.
What freedom am I giving up by not being a douche bag and actually answering the questions without complaining??
Did the officer ask him what his sex life was like? Did the officer call him in appropriate names?
NO.
So why the need to complain?
Crossing an international border most people have great intentions, but some people do not.
So if you have a problem with Border Service Officers asking you questions then do not cross.
Simple.
Or just answer the questions so you can go.
They are not there to hassle you, they are there for the bad guys who smuggle drugs or wish to do bad to others (whether thats a theif/rapist/murderer/drunk driver etc...)
I wonder with your supposed "open borders" who should be allowed to cross? just canadians and americans? or should it just be the innocent people who do not need to stop to speak with an officer?
What about the drug runners?
I geuss if we legalize cocaine and heroin then there would not be much of an issue anyways...
Or if we got rid of the legals system then it would not matter that the drunk driver or foreign national with 20 DUI´s on his record come into Canada and smash into your neighbours vehicle.
Love it or hate it the law is needed because not everyone is innocent and some people prey on the innocent.
And since whining won´t actually help your situation why not try and be polite while crossing, answer all the questions, and go home knowing that a law enforcement officer is diligently trying to keep you and Canada safe (keeping guns/drugs off the street sure keep your children and streets safer)
jp
[21-09-2009,22:56]
[**.86.138.75]
jp |
(in reply to: Canadian Rights? - 2)
PS.
Bill I agree with you.
Good Posting.
And Richard, Border Security is more than terrorists.
JP
[21-09-2009,22:59]
[**.86.138.75]
jp |
(in reply to: Canadian Rights? - 2)
I couldn´t agree more with "jp", "Bill" and "Sharon". Keep up the good work!
[22-09-2009,02:38]
[**.79.111.25]
Totallyagree |
(in reply to: Canadian Rights? - 2)
When flying into Tampa from Europe to help the city of St. Petersburg organize their Tall Ship even me a Canadian was fingerprinted and photographs for 3 1/2 hours. The USINS Officer rarely if ever gave me a chance to finish my answer without asking another question.
He knew something that he thought I was hiding which was not true.
I was admitted and all was good but it takes time to answer and listen to the answers. It wasn´t until I realized what he wanted me to tell them that all went away.
They get lied to every day so are they jaded? Probably but race had nothing to do with my ordeal and I was almost denied entry over a misunderstanding.
Roy
www.cvimmigration.com
[22-09-2009,10:34]
[**.229.22.108]
Roy |
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