Salary War: psych. vs. engineer. round 4

Canadian Universities Forum (discussion group)


 
 
Subject: Salary War: psych. vs. engineer. round 4
Yes, those figures are in Alberta. And can you provide a source for the claim that all salaries are higher in Alberta? Please. Kids say the dardenst things!

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According to the APA (American Psychological Association),

Psychologists with a Doctorate:
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Applied Psychology - Industrial/Organizational - $130,059

Applied Psychology - Other Psychology - $92,500

Administration of Applied Psychology - $143,344

Research Positions - $78,000

Research Administration - $95,000

Direct Human Services - Clinical - $75,000

Direct Human Services - Counseling - $65,000

Direct Human Services - School - $78,000

Direct Human Services - Other Psychological Subfields - $75,500

Administration of Human Services - $75,000

Look at THIS: Pg. 27

http://www.siop.org/salary%20survey2003.0305.pdf

25+ years from receiving doctorate, and the average salary is $175,404. One guy raked in $236,700.

Show me an engineer who makes more than 200k

[09-08-2006,04:03]
Anonymous
(in reply to: Salary War: psych. vs. engineer. round 4)
Years since obtaining doctorate and salary (90th percentile):

<2: $69,800 ($98,650)
2-4: $77,040 ($106,400)
5-9: $92,494 ($139,500)
10-14: $104,241 ($166,600)
15-19: $120,694 ($190,000)
20-24: $141,978 ($256,000)
25+: $175,404 ($236,700)

SOURCE: pg. 27, http://www.siop.org/salary%20survey2003.0305.pdf

[09-08-2006,04:19]
Anonymous
(in reply to: Salary War: psych. vs. engineer. round 4)
^ for you dense engineering wannabes out there, the first figure is the mean, second is that in the 90th percentile.
[09-08-2006,04:20]
Anonymous
(in reply to: Salary War: psych. vs. engineer. round 4)
"can you provide a source for the claim that all salaries are higher in Alberta?"

http://www12.statcan.ca/english/census01/products/analytic/companion/earn/provs.cfm

*Average annual earnings in 2000 were highest in the Northwest Territories, followed by two provinces, Ontario and Alberta.*

straight from StatsCan, Census 2001. Census 2006 isn´t up yet. It´s common knowledge, but I didn´t expect a dumbass like you to know.

Keep dreaming about your 150k salary lol, seriously, this is a joke. Who goes into psychology thinking they´ll make good money, honestly. And you post salary surveys of industrial psychology, and requiring a doctorate at that. you´re getting too specific, we want a view of the salaries of the field as a whole. and you also put US salaries, which are different than salaries in Canada. All the numbers you posted are WORTHLESS. if you want to know what american psychologists really make, go to the US department of labor site:
http://www.bls.gov/oco/ocos056.htm

"Median annual earnings of wage and salary clinical, counseling, and school psychologists in May 2004 were $54,950. [..]
Median annual earnings of wage and salary industrial-organizational psychologists in May 2004 were $71,400. The middle 50 percent earned between $56,880 and $93,210. The lowest 10 percent earned less than $45,620, and the highest 10 percent earned more than $125,560."

as you can see, you focused on the group (industrial-org. psych.) that made the most money! who do you think you´re fooling?

an engineer who makes more than 200K? we can start with the 3rd richest man in the world: Carlos Slim Hel?
"He is an engineer by profession, graduated from the Universidad Nacional Aut?noma de M?xico (UNAM) (National Autonomous University of Mexico) in 1961"
source: Wikipedia

7th richest man: Bernard Arnault, graduated with an engineering degree.

you can say it´s not so clear if they work as engineers, but I´d be surprised if CEO´s of large engineering firms (who are almost always engineers) didn´t make over 200k, such as Jacques Lamarre at SNC-Lavalin.

Seriously, just stop, this is getting pathetic.

[09-08-2006,04:30]
Anonymous
(in reply to: Salary War: psych. vs. engineer. round 4)
Dr. Eric Emerson Schmidt (born 1955) is Chairman and CEO of Google Inc. Schmidt obtained a bachelor of science degree in electrical engineering from Princeton University, and an MS in 1979 and Ph.D. in 1982 in EECS from the University of California, Berkeley. He was a joint author of lex, an important tool for compiler writing.

Net worth: $4.8 billion USD (2005)

[09-08-2006,04:39]
Anonymous
(in reply to: Salary War: psych. vs. engineer. round 4)
but anyway, your point about an engineer making over 200k is irrelevant. A college dropout, Bill Gates, makes more than any professional in the world.

we want averages to see the bigger picture. and the fact of the matter is, the average salary for engineers is significantly more than the average salary of psychologists.

[09-08-2006,04:43]
Anonymous
(in reply to: Salary War: psych. vs. engineer. round 4)
meant to say:

but anyway, your point about an engineer making over 200k is irrelevant. A college dropout, Bill Gates, makes more than any professional in the world. does that mean college dropouts make more than doctors, engineers, lawyers, etc.?

[09-08-2006,04:44]
Anonymous
(in reply to: Salary War: psych. vs. engineer. round 4)
1. LOL. NWT! So, Alberta has the 3rd highest average annual income, not 1st. And it is impossible to infer that this means that all incomes are inflated. Certainly it depends on the profession.

2. The answer is nobody wants to become a psychologist because of the money. People pursue it because they enjoy psychology! The same can be said about engineering. Who goes into engineering for the money!? Sure, you start out at a higher salary than most, but it isn´t long before you max out at around 100k (if you´re lucky).

3. Salaries in the U.S. are not much different from those in Canada. Unfortunetly, we don´t have a detailed and accurate salary survey for psychologists like they do in the U.S., so why not use the APA survey as a general guide?

4. I used the salaries of industrial/organizational psychologists to show you that psychologists are capable of making a lot of money. The mean salary of psychologists as a whole according to the link you provided is basically the same as that of engineers. Engineers, if you look at the statistics on the site, generally range from 60-80k. Pertroleum engineers make a lot, but, as you know, they will be declining in the years to come. Thus, on average, there is no major differences between the mean incomes of psychologists and engineers. However, the earning potential is greater for that of a psychologist as is demonstrated by the links I provided in the above posts. Sure, engineers can make a lot by switching to management positions, but those that reach senior level management positions are few and far between.

5. Good looking out on those rich dudes. While they were originally "engineers", I think it´s safe to say that they made their fortune as business men, not engineers. I meant find me an engineer who makes 200k+ while still being an engineer.

6. Since we are talking about psychologists vs. engineers, it is assumed that we are talking about those holding a doctorate degree. You can´t be a psychologist with just a bachelors like an engineer can.

[09-08-2006,04:57]
Anonymous
(in reply to: Salary War: psych. vs. engineer. round 4)
You might find it interesting that I don´t even WANT to be a psychologist. I just know about the profession since it´s one of my majors along with biochemisty. The reason why I continue to debate with you is because I like to argue. lol.
[09-08-2006,05:03]
Anonymous
(in reply to: Salary War: psych. vs. engineer. round 4)
1. READ my original post

"these are alberta salaries, not representative of all of canada, but rememeber that wages are highest in Alberta and Ontario."
i said BOTH alberta and ontario had the highest wages, and i was implying for *provinces*. sue me for not mentioning NWT, although i knew salaries would be high in the territories since nobody exactly wants to work there, therefore they hike up the salaries.

2. That´s great that you´re in psych for the love of it, but don´t brainwash the kids here that they´d be making 150k with their psych degree. and i know plenty of ppl who are in engineering for the money. you talk as if maxing out at 100k is a bad thing lol! how many ppl can ever earn 6 figures in their damn lifetime?!? And you don´t have to be lucky to make 100k in engineering. 30% of engineers already do!

http://www.canada-city.ca/canadian-universities/posting.php?messageid=4218
read the last few posts

engineers salaries on bls go from 60-90K (shows you Canadian engineers make more)
psychologists salaries on bls go from 40-70K
it´s not even close
any proof that petrolium engineers are dwindling?


3. salaries ARE different. In many cases, americans make more money. why do you think doctors are fleeing our country to make the big bucks in the states. In some cases though, canadians could also make more. like you said, depends on the occupation. You can use a guide if it shows the general picture of the salary situation for CANADIAN psychologists. the APA guide is not a canadian guide, and you also chose to focus on a subgroup within psychology, which also happens to be the one which is most highly paid. It´s like me showing a salary survey of american engineer CEOs and representing it as a survey of all engineers.
the bls survey is more representative of american psychologists than your APA figures:

Offices of other health practitioners $64,460
Elementary and secondary schools 58,360
Outpatient care centers 46,850
Individual and family services 42,640

And you don´t need a management position in engineering to make good money. Level E salaries are an average of 97k, Level D 83K. Please stop spreading your lies.

4. That´s great that psychologists can make that much. Hey look, college dropouts can become the richest people in the world! Look at Bill Gates! Paul Allen too! And how about Lawrence Ellison! I guess college dropouts have the greatest earning potential LOL for the last time, we´re trying to see a general picture here, and only averages can do that. And unfortunately, engineers on average make significantly more money.

5. Sure, but like i said, ask the CEO of large engineering firms like SNC or T.Y. Lin International how much they make and you´ll probably get your engineer making over 200k. But it´s irrelevant, refer to #4. We are looking at averages, and engineers make MUCH more (20k) than psychologists.

6. sure, as long as you compare it to engineers with doctorates.

yeah i like to argue too, actually. but dont´ expect a post from me until tomorrow night since i work, but then again, there´ll probably be part 10 by then and you´ll be arguing with someone else.

[09-08-2006,06:11]
Anonymous
(in reply to: Salary War: psych. vs. engineer. round 4)
Take this into account aswell. Engineers can take a year off in school or through co-op and earn money. So many will gaduate debt free and continue on MAKING money after graduation. My uncle is an electrical engineer and he went to UofT and participated in the PEY program. He made 31000 after taxes and the UofT fees and now after graduation saves about 20,000 grand a year for a house. He´s five years out of university and already has close to 100,000 saved. Whereas a psychology PHD is finsihing his last year and will still be paying off their debts years after they graduate.
[09-08-2006,12:27]
Anonymous



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